Bio Toilets

Mr.Veeresh Malik has blogged on Jairam Ramesh's  remark of our trains being a veritable toilets.


Given to me I would rather have called it 'resolving peristaltic motion of rural India'. From Billy Gates to Jairam Ramesh had been at it. Some how I am not an enthusiast of the bio dry method. I am a bit skeptic on that project and am for septic toilets. You have seen the dry bio and found it good though a bit complicated at first to operate. I have not seen it and know it only from net. In US on the highways in some of the rest areas they were there and the look of it made my urge calm down and I waited for the next one where regular ones I am accustomed were there. Probably they may be alright for use in ones own home where we can maintain it well. For public use I cannot think of the mess it will be. In India I cannot dream of going to a public toilet except the 'pay and use' ones. Not that they are much better. Compared to free for all they are better. In variably the previous user would have left some remains in the bowl water and left plenty of water everywhere else. In such places I prefer the Indian style as my bottom need not come in contact with the seat. Using a paper cut on the seat is never heard of. In the dry ones I am perplexed how the bowl can be kept clean. In them I read that once you sit on the seat automatically the bottom, not yours but that of the toilet, opens and the feces directly falls on to the chamber where its digestion process starts and automatically an exhaust fan works sucking the air through the seat to upper regions through an exhaust pipe. So no foul smell comes up to the room as in the case of pit latrines. It is all good on paper while in practice some feces will be sticking on the side walls which cannot be removed and in time it will be dirty like anything. We Indians are accustomed to wash our bottoms rather than wipe it. So much water will go into the chamber and it will get filled before the excreta is digested and become manure. If such a public toilet is established in every village no one will need to ask where it is. His or her nose will take you there.
We are basically dirty. It is no use blaming China if it said something true. Even when we can keep some public place neat we do not bother. We do not have any compunction to litter. Any one munching 'mungphally' got in a paper cone from the 'bhayya' in Chowpathy will throw away the paper just like that. So public toilets cannot be expected to be clean. And it is dry it will be worse. It is better to have septic toilets. Of course it will require water. Any way for living we need water. For cooking or drinking or bath we need it. We cannot avoid it. So let a little more for our toilet also. Then the commode will be a little neater if everyone take care to keep it so. Further the methane from the septic can be used as fuel. The methane from common toilets can be used to light the village streets and reduce the consumption of electricity. And the effluent can be used for fields. In the trains I would say it is not much the problem of rail getting corroded due to the feces falling on them. first of all the wheels when it passes over them it is dispersed. But it is the people who are responsible. On the doors it is written that try to avoid using toilets at stations. I do not know how many have read it or of those read how many follow it. So every rails by the platforms are real shit holes. That should be stopped. It will be good that toilet doors can be made that it will not open at stations. Make it that it will open only when the train is running. Of course there should be an emergency key to open with railway staff.


vkguptan@gmail.com

Madhura the irrepressible girl

Madhura, the perfect embodiment of our chalta hai attitude-- Blog by Asha Rai in Times of India

 "Indian contingent’s ten second blink & miss cameo at the Olympic opening ceremony, "- That is it. Normally it would have been exactly that. But thanks to Madhura it has attracted many. Why blame her. Her entry into the scene was least expected but it gave a pep to the show. An apart from the fact that the act against the prescribed norms it affected the ceremonial march in no way. She mingled with the scenery very much. It was not a drunk making a scene or a sem-clad cheer leader making convulsions. It was a perfectly dressed young exuberant girl making the drab things lively. As regards her parents sending her to London for studies, so many students go there. Also so many people go to London and elsewhere on tour now a days.

vkguptan@gmail.com

Cop and Me

It is curious that I had a dream that I was caught by police for rash and negligent driving. I cannot even ride a bicycle leave alone a two wheeler or afford a four wheeler or even if I bought a four wheeler afford the petrol.In dream I was riding the moped of my brother. It was registered in Gujarat and even though some years had gone by he did not transfer it to his new place of residence. It was not worth it and he rode it just in and around the village when he went to get a pack of cigarette or like. Needless to say that I have no license  to drive  any of those mechanical contraptions. But in my dream it did not bother me when I started riding my brother's moped. I was going very fast that at a signal I could not manage to brake and stop it and it shot forward and crashed into the traffic before it stopped. There was not much damage for either to my moped, I mean my brothers moped, nor to the two vehicles I crashed into. One of them was an auto rikshaw. I was sort of half way middle of the road and stopped there. The auto rikshaw and other vehicle went away without bothering me. I was sort of relieved that there was no trouble due to my negligence. Then I looked back and saw that a cop was standing at the corner and was busy writing on his note book. I got panicked. My fear was two fold. One thing that I did not have a licence and the vehicle was registered in Guarat. How to solve this problem? I racked my brain to no avail. Meanwhile I pushed the moped towards the cop. He just gave me a casual look and started filling up the note book. After a gap of some ten seconds I made a perfunctory cough to attract his attention. He obliged me. He looked at me with raised eyebrows. I came to the point directly and told  ' I made a small accident'. He told 'Yes I saw it'. But stopped at that and went busy with his book and pen.

To me he was one of the greatest writers. After waiting for another half minute I made my cough once again. Due to practice I had perfected the art of coughing. ' Sir, the accident, the case' I stopped at that. In such circumstances I thought telegraphic language is the best. He stopped his writing and gave me blank look for moment and then said ' You jumped the Red and made an accident and crashed to the vehicles'. I admitted that in fact I did and added ' Is it necessary to charge a case. Though I crashed the vehicles were not damaged and no injury to any one'. He countered ' That is not the point. You broke law and we will have to take up'. I scratched my head gave all indications of being one of the humblest of all human beings who jumped red signal. Even Uriah Heep had been present would have taken a lesson or  two in humility and obsequiousness. 'Is there no other way?' I asked looking into my pocket. 'Hmm' He gave a response. I immediately put my pocket and lifted some pieces of papers and hundred rupee note and a fifty rupee note which was the only money I had at that time. He gave me a look of disdain expressed his look in aural form with a grunt. As he knew that I could not have deciphered his look and grunt he translated those to verbal form 'What, it won't get me a breakfast even'!  I explained that that was all the wealth I possessed at that time. I will have to go home for more. Then our haggling started. Basically I have no experience in haggling. But after accompanying my wife when she went to purchase vegetables  I had some fundamentals. That is to begin with always halve the quoted price and then proceed slowly up while your opponent comes down slowly till you meet at a point and fix the price at that. I employed this tactic and finally we fixed it at 2000 rupees.
 It was decided we will go to my house in the police jeep for the cash. I told him that I don't have cash and asked whether he can take it by cheque which stoutly refused to. So far the whole conversation was going in Hindi. When everything was settled to the satisfaction of both parties I told him in English 
'Okay let us go'. Immediately the cop turned red and started to abuse me. In Hindi ofcourse. You are English and you want to do this. No no I will charge you. My entreaties did nothing to calm down his temper. And to add to discomfort confuse things further the auto rikshaw came to the spot and the driver jumped out and accosted me. He shouted 'You have to pay me. My auto is damaged'. I meekly said, that it looked perfectly okay. He immediately pointed his hand at the auto and 'Look'. I looked but could not see anything in particular and told him so. He dragged me nearer to the auto and pushed my head down and asked to look. I saw a hairline scratch. 'Yes there is a very thin scratch' I told him. He forcefully turned my head to another place and there also saw a small scratch. I told him that okay I will give 200 rupees for painting. He gave me a look as if I am some creature from Mars and told '200 rupees'? I asked him how much he wanted. Instead of giving me a quote for the damages he fished out a pocket book from his pocket and opened a page and put a finger somewhere and asked me to look. I saw it was a page of a calendar and he had put his finger at the date 10 on it. I could not believe. 'WHAT' I asked. He told plainly that he wanted 10 thousand as damages. I could not believe him. But my worry was will not the cop also raise his demand to match with that of the auto man.
 I looked up at the cop and found that he too was dumb-struck probably this atrocious demand. Things had come to this stage and I did not have any ready solution to this predicament I had got in. I thought it better go home and try to sort it out. I told the cop so. He called the jeep which was standing a bit away. It came near us. When I looked I found that the driver was just like the driver we had in our office. In fact I thought it was none other than our office driver. We all got in including the auto driver. Inside the jeep I just touched on the back of the driver and called him by the name of our office driver. He turned and looked at me in surprise. In fact it was he only. ' Oh Sab how are you here'? I gave him a short history of my recent adventures. He stopped the jeep and started to plead my case to the cop. Finally it was agreed that we all we go to my house and will have a small party and finish the whole affair at that . So went onward to my house and I was busy talking with the driver or should I call him my saviour? Since we were too busy talking I missed to instruct the driver to take the proper turn. I shouted ' Oh you missed the lane go back and turn right'. 
This was too loud and my wife woke up and asked me what happened. I told her that it was alright. I saw one dream and that it was good that she woke me up. Otherwise I don't know what else was there in store. 
vkguptan@gmail.com

Hot Dogs

Some fifty odd years back I was in Delhi and had to do shift duties. For the break I used to go with some of my friends to Connaught Place for some snacks and coffee. My favourite place was the Indian Coffee House there. At that time it was run from a small pucca building and customers sat under the shamiana. My favourite snack was 'hamburger'. It was two buns half fried on a oily tawa and with a piece of potato tikia and some onion rounds. What it did not have was the slice of 'ham'. Being a vegetarian of sorts I never missed that slice of ham. And then I never knew then that 'hamburger' should have 'ham' at all. I was under the impression that the thing was called so. Like Sundar who may not be so. Many many years later myself and my wife went to be with our son for few months in US. He showed us all the necessary tourist spots like Statue of Liberty, Niagara and all those places where Indian tourists flock and click. I think it was in Washington DC where we went to a McDonald for some snacks. My son asked us what we would like to have and told what are generally available there. So I told that I want hamburger. Then my son revealed the truth which has so far eluded me. That in US hamburger will have ham in it. He found out a solution. He went to the person on the counter and told to make four hamburgers but in two of them not to put put ham. The guy gave my son quizzical look but got busy with making a ham burger without ham.
 Like that I used to wonder what is this 'Hot Dog'. It was a name I have come across in English novels quite often. If it was a Chinese delicacy I would not have had any doubt at all. It should be the real 'bow bow'.
By the way I think you all would have read a news of a proposal. All the street dogs to be sent to North East so that there the people can enjoy Real Hot Dogs and even conduct eating competitions.

vkguptan@gmail.com

TOEFL for bureaucrats

Eureka !, Gotcha !! or simply I got it. Mr.Mohapatra must have told that ' I won't allow you to go until you finish the work'. When he told 'allow'  it would have sounded like ' I love ', and when he added 'finish the work' she could have misunderstood again ( about the nature of the work). It will be better if all Government offices insist that unless one successfully completes TOEFL no one will be allowed to go to US or any country where the common language is English. As regards politicians one cannot expect them to pass, leave aside TOEFL, any examination unless copying is permitted. Since they are shameless it will not matter also.

Molestation and Dressing Provacatively

What NCW chairperson Ms.Mamata Sharma told is sane advice. It is no use castigating her for that. Provocatively dressing may not be the only criteria which encourage molesting. There will other factors. But is one of them. Our male are a sex-starved lot. Why so is not known but they are. The general public get attracted to sex and that is why most of the films from all the 'woods' are full of them. Years back one has to go and see English movies if one wants to see female skin and the attractive parts. Now our own fare is full of them. Even this news paper is full of such papers. Previously there used to be the photo of cleavages in the back page of Blitz which was the only source a youngster can look at it. Now a days it is difficult to avoid such pictures. So people are all primed to look at it live. So a small incident triggers it. Rape is actually different from these molestations. In molestation those doing it has no intention of a sexual intercourse. It is just to see the bare flesh, touch it and enjoy the discomfiture of the victim. In the case of rape it is raw sexual urge. That is why whether the victim is dressed covering her body or not does not matter. So also the age of victim. We hear occasionally some elderly ladies of 60 or so being raped. The culprit is a sex maniac who wants his carnal desire to be satisfied at any cost. Molestation is different. And the provocative dressing makes the victim more vulnerable to molestation. No use of blaming NCW chairperson for telling some home truth.

Immediate arrest of US Marines

VIndia should immediately send its full Navy force and bring the offender US Navy ship to Mumbai, dock it there and arrest all the Navy personnel for doing this atrocity on poor fishermen. It should not release the ship till it gets at least one billion dollars in gold. All the Navy personnel should be arrested and put in jail without bail and try as per Indian laws. The person died and those injured are Indian citizen and India has full right to try them. Further Arabian Sea is part of Indian Ocean and by name itself one can easily know that it belongs to India. So whatever happens in Indian Ocean is to be considered as having happened on Indian territory and dealt accordingly. Obama should be informed that India take these matters seriously and any happenings like this in future will make India to react much more strongly and attacking US is not to be ruled out. What these Yankees think. We the Indians with millions of years of glorious past and they with hardly half a millennium of history!!! Mera Bharat Mahan. Time to note. We are not under-achievers but super achievers.

Guwahti Affair

 I read about this in India Today where it was given that the TV reporter Neogi was also present inside the pub where the girls were there. It was also given that Neogi was taking their picture in his mobile phone camera. Also that he asked two employees of adjacent shop selling liquors to keep the girls when they came out. Now what my thinking is that: Neogi saw the girls sipping drinks in a pub in the night. If a news reporter comes across some girls aged 17 years or so sipping drinks in pubs in the night it is news worthy and started to take photo graphs or video. To this, that is taking photos, the girls objected and there was some altercation between the reporter and the girls party and the club management asked them to clear out. When they came out the reported did not want to have a half finished job and asked his acquaintances (probably) in the Wine Shop to hold the girls till he got the camera crew to shoot a news worthy episode. The girls tried to escape but the persons who were asked to keep must have been rough in dealing with them. Meanwhile all riff-raffs joined in this and matter went much beyond what the reporter had imagined. The camera team came and so the reported must have decided to go ahead with shooting. Instead of girls drinking it became girls being molested. The loose end is what is the RTI activist Akhil Gogoi doing there with a video camera shooting all this? Does he move everywhere with a video camera? Why he himself did not do anything to save the girl and went on shooting? Why he did not call the police immediately he sensed trouble? He should be questioned thoroughly.

Enrica Lexie - Replay

This a tragic affair and I sympathise with the victims. But this will be an interesting case.When the Italian Marines mistook and fired and killed two Indian fishermen off the coast of Kerala everyone in Kerala from Oommen Chandy downwards plus Krishna, Antony et al were insisting that India has jurisdiction to try the case. The ship Enrica Lexie and the Italian Marines were tricked to come to Kochi port and the Marines were arrested pronto and the ship detained for nearly three months. The Marines got bail after some 100 days or so with so much restrictions that they are virtually prisoners not allowed to move out of sight of the Ernakulam police commissioner. One of the judges even went to the extent of declaring that the act can be considered a terrorist act from the point of view of the victims families. The law frowned at the compensation given by the Italian Government go the victims families. The government was toying with the idea of using SUA Act to try the case. Though better sense prevailed later and the idea was dropped. The question is will the US ship asked to come to an Indian port and kept there? Will the soldiers who shot and killed one Indian citizen and injured three other Indian citizens arrested and kept in jail? Will the Indian Government argue that since it was Indian citizen who was killed it is India Government which should try this case? India could bulldoze Italy. Can it do the same with US. I have been waiting for the out come of Enrica Lexie and now this also will equally interesting. Hope US will match the magnanimity Italy has shown.

Enrica Lexie--Purvakayastha and Rishab Bailey

In this Enrica Lexie incident the issue is which country has jurisdiction to try the marines who have been allegedly shot and killed two Indian fishermen. The question is tricky since the marines were on board an Italian ship from which they fired the shots and the dead fishermen were on a fishing boat registered in India and the dead fishermen were Indian citizen. To make it a little more complicated the two marines were deputed by the Italian government to protect the Merchant Vessel Enrica Lexie from pirate attacks.
The crime has started in one country and ended in another country. Then which country has the right to try the case. Here the question of why armed guards are employed in merchant ships, why the piracy started in Somalian waters and such other issues do not arise. Previously there were pirates in Indonesian coasts and if that had continued then also armed guards could have been employed. This is not a single case of piracy due to failure of the state of Somalia. If genuine fishermen are not able to fish as it is their living they should be allowed and all protection given. But at the same time international marine traffic should not be put to difficulties also.
In the article the two authors have mentioned the armed guards as trigger happy. What have they to tell about the hundreds of tribal people being killed by our trigger happy forces alleging of being Maoists? Is that also not equally reprehensible?
In this case, there is no doubt that, IF (I repeat IF) it was the Italian  marines who shot the fishermen , they have done something terrible wrong and they have to explain their action. The question is only to whom they should explain--to the Indian authorities whose citizens have been killed or to the authorities who have send them to protect the ship?

Sex Service Cess

What the government has missed but will certainly tax is 'Sex tax'. Once it is introduced every time a couple enjoy the ultimate bliss the happiness and ecstasy will be only momentary and will be erased by the tax which will have to be paid. And since it is enjoyment for both parties both will be taxed independently. You will have to keep a tab on the number of times you do in an year as you have to submit a sex-tax return at the end of financial year just like Income Tax returns. Those who do not submit will be levied is liable to be taxed at punitive tax rates. It will be advisable for every couple to keep a diary of their nocturnal activities including matinee and morning shows in a register kept safe away from the prying eyes of children like medicines. This tax will be applicable to those who do it on the sly as well. The tax for those who do it on the sly will be at double the rate for the honest ones. Once caught these ones will be taxed as if they were doing it throughout their adult hood and charged at double the rate. Those who refuse will be 'de-nutted' to avoid the eventuality that they may de-fraud the governments due in future

Insult to Democracy

There is a report in Times of India that Queen Elizabeth of England did not get time for these last four months to meet our envoy. This is definitely a great insult to India. Queen should have known that we are no more under British rule. Since midnight of August 15th of 1947 we are on our own. She should be made aware that we are the greatest democracy in the world. And for that matter in the whole of Universe. Not only that we are almost number one country in the whole world. It is just a matter of days for the world to realise it and give the respect due to us. If we do not get respect we will demand and take it. And where is Britain ? No more Britannia rules the waves. It rules a land less than the size of our so many provinces. And the monarchy. On the way to the abyss of history.

Look. No kings, queens or princes and princesses ever traveled in bullet proof cars. They traveled in old ramshackle horse drawn vehicles with all the public gazing at them in awe. Our modern ministers travel in slick and sleek limousines with bullet proof body and glasses. No one look at awe.( Everyone curses.) When you people travel it is some gaily decorated sepoys with spears on guard. Our ministers and other sundry VIPs are accompanied by all different shades of cats. Where are we and where are you? Does this show how important we are.
In fact when our envoy landed the queen should have come to airport to receive such an important person. If you do not go to airport to meet Obama it is alright. After all he is just the president of a nation which will loose its number one position to us in a matter of days. And even after landing our envoy is denied audience. Why such an insult?

In future if you by mistake take a decision to come here we will get even with you. You will be searched at airport by our uncouth staff. Our president will never give you an audience. At the most we will send our peon of MEA to receive you and we will instruct him not to extend any courtesy at all.

Law and Other Things: Murder Most Foul: Curious Case of the Italian Marines:

Law and Other Things: Murder Most Foul: Curious Case of the Italian Marines:

Topsy Turvy: Reply to Dr.Ajay Balachandran in ET comments

Topsy Turvy: Reply to Dr.Ajay Balachandran in ET comments: Dr.Ajay Balachandran, You have written '  I did read Mr.Stimson's paper and even that paper does show instances of US courts extending thei...

Reply to Dr.Ajay Balachandran in ET comments

Dr.Ajay Balachandran,
You have written ' I did read Mr.Stimson's paper and even that paper does show instances of US courts extending their jurisdiction into other countries (anyway that is just the opinion of one person)

VKG .  Mr.Stimson has written the article titled 'Conflicts in Criminal Laws' So he will naturally give all aspects and different applications made by different countries.

You have written :  I had replied to your Indo-Pak question. If pakistan manages to arrest an Indian soldier who fires into pakistan territory and kills a pakistani, he will definitely be tried in pakistan. Because the Indian soldier (through the agent of the bullet) committed a crime in pakistan. It is another matter that India wont hand over the soldier to them

VKG:   It means it is not the law which is applied but it is might what plays the major role The same way India managed by subterfuge to get the ship in Indian waters.

You have written: Hafiz Saeed is being tried in Indian courts now because he conspired to kill Indians sitting in Pakistan. He never set foot on India to commit this offense, the conspiracy was completely done inside pakistan. And pakistan is refusing to hand him over to India. Do you have any doubt that if he is caught, he will be tried in India? We will definitely do that.

VKG  Case of Hafiz Saeed is different. It is a case of conspiracy and terrorism. In my opinion terrorism is sort of waging war against a nation. In such case the conspirator should be extradited to the affected nation as per extradition treaty. In this case of alleged shooting by Marines no such conspiracy or terrorism is involved. One of the learned and honourable judge has observed that the shooting can be viewed as a terrorism with which I cannot agree nor any independent person  who know the law will agree. These two are entirely different issues and cannot be compared.

You have written : *Another point is that Saeed is being tried in India, investigated in Pakistan and will probably be tried in the US for the same offense which happened in India. Read that with this situation (of the marines). *The key point is that people do get tried for the same offense twice. Whatever Mr.Simson argues, the world is not the way he wants it to be. 

VKG : People do many things but they all need not be as per law. We have our Rajas, Kalamadis, Kanimozhis et el who have done so many things which is not as per law. So if somebody is tried for the same offence twice it need not be as per the rule. But if I remember correctly Mr.Stimson has told that a person cannot be punished for the same offence twice. About trying I do not know. Unfortunately the world is not the way he wants to be. Because I think he is level headed person.

You have written : .Lets analyze the shooting case one more time using an example. Lets suppose a ship registered in Singapore (stolen earlier) carrying (allegedly) Somalian Pirates fires upon an Italian flag ship in International waters and kills people on board. The pirates dont board the Italian ship, but goes away. Would you (or the Italians) say that the case must be tried in Singapore? Or Somalia? Italians would definitely try the case in Italy if they manage to catch the pirates.

VKG: That is the issue. It comes under whose jurisdiction. Is it the shooting which takes precedence or death which takes precedence? That is what Supreme Court of India has to deal with

VKG : Laws governing piracy and mutiny on ships are different. A ship of any nation which is nearby to where the incident has happened can go for helping the captain and crew of a ship being attached by pirates or go and help the captain of the ship on which there has happened a mutiny by crew. The country whose flag the ship which has gone to help the ship in trouble takes over the charge of the ship. As far as I know later the trial of the pirates or mutinous crew can be done either by the country whose ship went for help or by the country whose ship was attacked by pirates or the crew mutinied. It is on the basis of this law only the Japanese ship which was attacked and taken over by Indonesian pirates was tried in Bombay.

You have written :  The principle which has to be followed here is that the from where the assailant shoots does not matter. He is extending his presence where the bullet lands. So it is the law of where the bullet lands that has to take precedence here (more than the fact that assailants were apprehended by Indian forces - who can automatically initiate proceedings)

You have written :  In short, the italian marines had boarded the Indian fishing boat through the agent of the bullets. So they must be tried in India. There is no legal basis in distinguishing this case from the scenario where (say) the marines board the fishing boat and shoot the fishermen at point blank range or stab them to death.

VKG : That is your view and only thing is that I do not agree with that view. Because I am of the opinion is 'pulling the trigger' by the marines or rather "alleged" pulling the trigger. It has not yet been established in a court of law that they shot and killed the fishermen. It is all police version. That pulling the trigger happened in Italian territory.

You have written :  As for Raval's opinion, eminent legal luminaries including VR Krishna Iyer hold different views. So he may have been influenced by Italy before he started the argument. The opinion of a lawyer does not matter here. The lawyer appearing for India must put forward India's view, not his.

VKG : When you engage a lawyer for representing your case, as regards the legal aspect, the lawyer tells the judge what are the relevant legal point connected with the case. He is not coming to the court to read out what you have written yourself and wanted to be told to the court. Raval has told the point what he thinks is correct. Since Kerala wanted something else he was changed to one who is more amenable. I don't dispute the greatness of Mr.VR.Krishna Iyer. But it is not necessary that he will not make any mistake at all. After all he is not God Almighty.

Enrica Lexie--Random Thoughts

1.Bail for Marines.    Within 10 days of arresting the Marines police had got whatever information was possible to get from the Marines they had got. What was the necessity of keeping them for another 80 days more? When a sovereign nation takes responsibility to present them whenever necessary is it not sufficient enough to release them on bail? And finally when they were granted bail what was the necessity of two people who have assets worth one crore each from Kerala also to stand surety? Are the two citizens bigger surety than a sovereign nation?

2. Why the families of the fishermen who were killed should be blamed if they accept money from Italian Government? Government's main issue was the criminal aspect of the case. By giving compensation and the victims families accepting it can in no way affect the criminal case. It is only civil aspect which is concerned. The victims families were satisfied with the compensation and they have declared they don't have any more complaints. There was nothing wrong in either giving money or accepting it. If the poor families had not accepted it they would have to go as destitute till the case is finally settled which at the current pace would have taken years.

3. Why the ship was also kept so long after the inspection was over and all evidence taken and the suspected weapons taken why it was detained so long. The owners incur heavy loss when a ship is detained and the government is well aware of it.

4.  Lotus case has made a bad precedence. It is clear cut case of collision in high seas and flag country of the ship which made the collision should have jurisdiction. The decision in the case of German ship colliding with English ship was the right one- that is as per existing laws. Otherwise maritime laws should be re-written.

5. In the case of Prabhu Daya which collided with an Indian fishing boat and sank it, why India arrested the ship and crew. It was a Singapore flagged ship. But only thing was that the crew were Indian. Was it on that basis India took all the steps?

Topsy Turvy: Crime and Punishment

Topsy Turvy: Crime and Punishment: When we were all barbarians our criminal justice was done more on the basis of vendetta. An eye for an eye or an ear for an ear. Probably wh...

Crime and Punishment

When we were all barbarians our criminal justice was done more on the basis of vendetta. An eye for an eye or an ear for an ear. Probably when returned it could have been with some interest also added to the principal. With advance from the barbarian state to modern civilized state did not our criminal justice also advanced? Do we punish someone who has perpetrated a crime as a vendetta? Is not the modern cultured society dispense its justice system as a deterrent so that perpetrator will not repeat it again? A crime done against an individual is as much a crime to the society as well. Is it not why all the criminal cases are between the government and the perpetrator. The victim or the heirs of the victims do not have much voice in the case. They can only implead im the civil aspect of the case and not in the criminal aspect.
Why the society takes up the case? Because if the perpetrator may again do it against the society. He should be restricted from repeating it. So he has to be punished so that he understand that he has done a crime against the society and should not repeat it. It is not vendetta by the victim. It is to reform the criminal so that he is no danger to the society.
Which society should do this act of reforming the person who has done the criminal act? It is the society of which the individual who has done the crime is a part. It is not the victims side with whom he had only a casual contact. As long as a vendetta is an acknowledged system of criminal justice, the victim nor the society of which the victim is a part has no right to deal with the criminal aspect. Only the civil aspect where the victim or the victim's legal heirs can approach for appropriate compensation. So the society representing the victims cannot deal with the criminal case.
In the case of Enrica Lexie, when the two Italian Marines shot the two Indian fishermen, it is the Italian citizens who have committed the crime. Their sojourn in Indian territory is transitional. It is for very short while and in the normal case it cannot be expected that they will be repeating the same shooting again. India need not have any concern on that count.
On the other hand for Itally it is not so. These are two Marines who could be armed quite often. If they are trigger happy to shoot at anyone at the slightest provocation of suspicion they are dangerous to the Italian society. So it is Italy which should take precautionary steps that such things do not repeat.
And so I think it is Italy who should try the marines and not India.

Topsy Turvy: Enrica Lexie- Shyam Kumar- View from Above

Topsy Turvy: Enrica Lexie- Shyam Kumar- View from Above: Shyam Kumar's comment on Jon Bellish. SKsays--  " Sec. 3 of the Indian Penal Code reads as follows: Sec. 3: Punishment for offences comm...

Topsy Turvy: Enrica Lexie -place of shooting and place of death...

Topsy Turvy: Enrica Lexie -place of shooting and place of death...: In Enrica Lexie case let us take an imaginary situation. Let one of the fishermen was standing near the edge of the boat and one shot hit h...

Enrica Lexie -place of shooting and place of death

In Enrica Lexie case let us take an imaginary situation. Let one of the fishermen was standing near the edge of the boat and one shot hit him on his legs and he falls down to the sea and is drowned. His death has occurred in the sea. Then which court has jurisdiction to indict? India or Italy. India cannot as the death occurred in the sea. India has no jurisdiction on international waters. It is Italian courts which can take up the case. That means the country in whose jurisdiction was the perpetrator of the crime was standing is the country which has to try the case. Since it is the position of jurisdiction, the jurisdiction cannot shift if the victim was in some other place. It is the place where the crime was initiated which is more important than where its result occurred.
That means Italy has to take up this case and not India.

Enrica Lexie points

1. Italian Marines shot and killed two Indian fishermen.

First they shot at the fishermen and due to its effect the two fishermen were killed. The first action was shooting. It was done while the Marines were in a ship under the flag of Italy. To shoot at someone with an intent to injure or kill has to be a crime anywhere. That act was done by two persons who were Italian citizens and standing on Italian on international waters as far as criminal jurisdiction is concerned and flying Italian flag. So they have to be tried by the Italian courts. In the case of Queen v. Keyne even though the German ship which collided with an English ship and consequently an English passenger died the verdict was equally divided the power of English court to try the German Captain even though the collision happened very much in English waters. So here since the event happened in international waters there cannot be any doubt about the jurisdiction of which court has to try the case. It is definitely Italian court.

It is the action which was against the law and hence the perpetrator  is to be punished. Even the prosecution is telling the shooting was unprovoked as the fishermen were unarmed and quite far. So to shoot at unarmed person(s) itself is crime. That crime happened in virtual Italian soil and Italian courts has full authority to try the criminal case. Indian courts has no authority. The aggrieved parties can file a civil suit for compensation. (I am not in position to tell where it can be filed as of now-whether in Indian courts or Italian courts) The criminal case is to be dealt by Italian court only. In US no court of a particular state will take up a case which falls under the authority of another state.

Here the aggrieved parties who had co-pleaded in the case has since withdrawn their plea as the money they got was sufficient for them and no civil suit will ensue further. Only the criminal case is there still to be settled and it should be done in Italian courts.

Sections 2 ,3 and 4 of IPC

Section 2 of IPC.   2. Punishment of offences committed within India.- Every person shall be liable to punishment under this Code and not otherwise for every act or omission contrary to the provisions thereof, of which, he shall be guilty within Indian.


Indian Penal Code was written by First Indian Law Commission which was formed in 1834 and the whole thing completed in 1837 and submitted to Governor General in Council in 1837. 
At the time of writing where transportation and communication was far from advanced when a letter from England to India may take some six months to reach the members who had been entrusted to draft the IPC could have hardly imagined that a person sitting in Australia or some other place will commit an offence in England or India. So it is just natural to take it for granted that the offence and offender must be at the same place. It is only after the transportation was quicker after steam ships were normal and communication also consequently was quicker and then after telegraph was invented and cables were laid across the vast oceans were laid it was possible for someone sitting thousands of miles away could commit a crime at a distant place. At the time of writing the IPC the honourable members entrusted with that arduous task never had an inkling of suspicion that the offender will be far away from the place where the offence has taken place.
So the inherent meaning of this clause is everyone irrespective of his national status or caste or creed or religion or anything if an offence is committed in India is liable to be punished as per Indian laws and it is inherently implied that the offender was corporeally present at the place of offence. To interpret that even if the offender was at some other place is nothing but mis-interpreting the Code. It is separating the sense and the words and interpreting the words only.
Section 3 of IPC.  3. Punishment of offences committed beyond but which by law may be tried within India.- Any person liable by any Indian law to be tried for an offence committed beyond India shall be dealt with according to the provisions of this Code for any act committed beyond India in the same manner as if such act had been committed within India.
Section 4 of IPC  4. Extension of Code to extra territorial offences.- The provisions if this Code apply also to any offence committed by- (1) any citizen of India in any place without and beyond India; (2) any person on any shop or aircraft registered in India wherever it may be.
Here IPC is crossing the border. But it is not a free bird that it can fly and settle anywhere. It goes to a specific target. The person who has committed an offence in a foreign land. A nation is bound to protect its citizens wherever they might be and also punish them wherever they might be. So if a person has committed a felony in a foreign land as a citizen he or she will be punished by Indian laws. IPC will not cross the border to punish a foreign citizen for an offence committed by him. If a foreigner commits a crime against a citizen of India as long as the person is in the foreign land IPC cannot do anything. But once that offender comes within the space where Indian laws prevail he or she can be punished for the offence.
IPC or CrPC or any other laws are interpreted to one's own convenience. Different judges give different interpretations. It is those differences in interpretations which helps many an accused and convicts also  many.
Till 1982 when United Nations has made laws relating to sea as per the UNCLOS the generally accepted  territorial sea limit was 3 miles. It was equivalent roughly to one league of length measurement. And this 3 miles limit was accepted for the purpose of protecting the land from fire or other attack from the sea. The cannon of that time could fire an iron ball to a maximum of 3 miles and so that limit was accepted.
Why this was quoted was when any persons write a law his outlook will be based on the facts prevailing at that period. When the IPC was written in the early half of 1830s those who were entrusted with that work would never have imagined that a crime could be committed remaining far away from the place where the crime has actually occurred. For them the perpetrator and the crime must have been always at the same place. If they had any suspicion of such thing happening they definitely would have added in Section 3 " any person anywhere" if foreign lands were also to be included. Section 2 is without any ambiguity as it states 'every person' as the incident is happening in inside India where its law run automatically. In Section 3 it is outside the reach of Indian law in general and it applies to only those who are liable to Indian laws. To me the law seems to be very clear and there is no scope to doubt about its intent. Inside India to each and every person. Outside India to those who are liable to Indian laws. 

Householder and his duties

Mr.Purohit, are you by any chance referring to my mail about the engine turning pit? For your kind information I am very free with my advises. As far as advises are concerned no parsimony. I could have given enough advises to Bill Gates about , not the engine pit but the 'shit pit'.
Just now I remembered that I have some advises or suggestion regarding our IPC. Do you know as per clauses 297 and 299 a householder vis a vis an intruder is very much at a disadvantageous position. As far as IPC is concerned the intruder has upper hand house holder is at the receiving end. Suppose a burglar opens the window, remove the grill, get inside and open all safes, almirahs and wardrobes and relieves the householder of all his valuables and dresses, and before calling it a day or to be precise calling it a night, goes to the kitchen and opens the refrigerator and gets a shock, an electric shock and not the shock of seeing no ice and water to mix a drink, the householder can get ready to get a shock, this time not electric but mental. The burglar can sue the householder for keeping a faulty refrigerator and giving electric shock to innocent burglars. The court will award the sentence in favour of the burglar. First the householder  have to bear all expenses for the treatment of the shocked burglar. Then he has to pay for the mental agony and physical agony the burglar had to undergo because of the faulty refrigerator. If he is asked to take rest for some time the householder has to pay for the losses incurred by the burglar as he was incapacitated from pursuing his occupation for the period. Everyone has to make a living. If a farmer do farming a thief has to do thieving and court  recognizes all professions at equal footing.
An advise to all. Keep your refrigerator always in good condition. You don't know when your nightly guest may be dropping in.

Enrica Lexie- Shyam Kumar- View from Above

Shyam Kumar's comment on Jon Bellish.

SKsays--  "Sec. 3 of the Indian Penal Code reads as follows:

Sec. 3: Punishment for offences committed beyond but which by law may be tried within India: Any person liable by any Indian law to be tried for an offence committed beyond India shall be dealt with according to the provisions of this Code for any act committed beyond India in the same manner as if such act had been committed within India. (emphasis supplied).

VKG---It is applicable to ' Any person liable by an Indian law'. The Marines were in the contiguous zone on an Italian flagged ship and hence not liable by an Indian law. It is applicable only if 'the marines were on Indian soil'. If they were on Indian soil only then they are subjected to Indian laws.

SK:-------Section 3 of the Penal Code reproduced above has the following attributes:
(a) It applies to all persons including foreigners and is not confined to citizens of India.
(b) The said section presupposes the existence of an Indian law under which a person can be made liable for an offence committed beyond India, i.e., beyond the territorial limits of India.
(c) If such an Indian law exists, then the person liable under that law is to be dealt with according to the provisions of the Indian Penal Code for such offence committed beyond India.
(d) While being so dealt with under the Indian Penal Code, a presumption follows that the offence had been committed within India.

VKG:----a) It applies to all persons including foreigners..................................  Provided the foreigner was in Indian soil or where Indian law applies and it was not the case.

b,c,d ) As for (a) as the law is not valid for a foreigner on a foreign soil or  a place equivalent to foreign soil. The ship under Italian flag in contiguous zone is same as Italy.

SK.....

Section 3 applies to all persons including non-citizens. Hence the Captain of the vessel as well as the two Italian Marines who are foreign citizens, presently in India are squarely covered by the said provision.

VKG ......As stated above the Section 3 of IPC is not applicable to the Italian Marines. They were brought to India by force or false pretenses and that act itself amounts to an illegal act amounting to kidnapping.

ADMIRALTY  OFFENCES (COLONIAL) ACT.

First of all Admiralty Offences (Colonial ) Act was made by British Crown to deal with its innumerable colonies in its heyday. It is accepted that Indian Constitution has accepted it but intent was to rule the colonies. In the Indian Republic its relevance is not a true thing though we can bring it at our convenience.

SK....The Admiralty Offences (Colonial) Act, 1849 is a statute which envisages extraterritorial operation and specifically deals with and empowers authorities to take legal action with respect to admiralty offences or offences committed upon the sea i.e., beyond the territorial waters of India. The said Act is protected vide Art. 372 of the Constitution of India and continues to have extra territorial effect pursuant to Explanation II to Art. 372.

Sec. 3 of the Admiralty Offences (Colonial) Act, 1849 reads as follows:

Provision, 7c., where death in the colony &c., follows from injuries inflicted on the sea, &c.,-

Where any person shall die in any colony of any stroke, poisoning, or hurt, such person having been feloniously stricken, poisoned, or hurt upon the sea, or in any haven, river, creek, or place where the admiral or admirals have power, authority, or jurisdiction, or at any place out of such colony, every offence committed in respect of any such case, whether the same shall amount to the offence of murder or of manslaughter, or of being accessory before the fact to murder, or after the fact to murder or manslaughter, may be dealt with, inquired of, tried, determined, and punished, in such colony, in the same manner and in all respects its if such offence had been wholly committed in that colony; and if any person in any colony shall be charged with any such offence as aforesaid in respect of the death of any person who, having been feloniously stricken, poisoned, or otherwise hurt, shall have died of such stroke, poisoning, or hurt upon the sea, or in any haven, river, creek, or place where the admiral or admirals have power, authority, or jurisdiction, such offence shall be held for the purpose of this Act to have been wholly committed upon the sea.

The above provision clearly and unequivocally empowers the authorities in India to deal with offences committed outside India which during the time of the enactment was referred to as a ‘Colony’. Mark the words ‘or at any place out of such colony’ as it specifically empowers the authorities to deal with, inquire into, try, determine and punish the offence in the same manner and respect as if it has been committed wholly in India. Thereby the Indian Authorities are empowered to invoke Admiralty Offences (Colonial) Act, 1849 over and above the IPC and CrPC in the case of ENRICA LEXIE.

VKG.......What is the relevance of this Act in this case. The act which was made at a time India was a colony of Britain is applicable to India as an independent Republic. India has its own power to deal with such offences enumerated in the above paragraphs. But this act does not give extra territorial powers on the colony or India.

SK.... In February 2003 fifteen Indonesian pirates who had boarded a Japanese ship named Alondra Rainbow were successfully prosecuted and convicted in Mumbai, India invoking inter alia the provisions Admiralty Offences (Colonial) Act, 1849. All pirates were sentenced to seven years of rigorous imprisonment with a fine of Rs.3000 for each crew member, in default of payment of fine, to suffer further rigorous imprisonment for two months.

VKG....In High Seas when a piracy occurs ships in the vicinity goes to help the victim ship. Which ever first ship reaches can take over the command. On that basis that country under whose flag the ship reached the spot and rescued the affected ship and caught the pirates have authority to deal with the pirates. In this case Indonesia did not have any objections for the outlaws from their country being tried by India. That case has no similarity to the present Enrica case.

Suppression of Unlawful Activities Act.

SK......

The Captain of the Vessel Enrica Lexie and the two Italian Marines are also liable to be prosecuted under the SUA Act, 2002. The SUA Act, 2002 vide S.1(2) extends to the Territorial Waters, the Continental Shelf, the Exclusive Economic Zone and any other Maritime Zone of India within the meaning of the Maritime Zones Act, 1976. Thus the jurisdiction of Indian authorities stand extended beyond the territorial waters of India up to the edge of the exclusive economic zone which is 200 nautical miles from the baseline. Offences within the said zone are thereby punishable under the SUA Act.

The SUA Act defines the term ‘Ship’ in S.2(h) as to include any floating craft. Thus both Enrica Lexie and the fishing boat St.Antony are ships/floating crafts and are thereby amenable to the SUA Act. Chapter II of the SUA Act lists the various offences under it. It lays down the punishment for such offences as well. Thereby it can be seen that it is a complete code in itself. Section 3 (1) (a), (b), (c), Section 3 (1) (g) (i) (iv) and (v) and Sec. 3 (7) and (8) (c) of Chapter II of the SUA Act, 2002 are specifically relevant.

Relevant portions of Section 3 (1) (a), (b) and (c) of the SUA Act, 2002 reads as follows:

Sec. 3 Offences against ship, fixed platform, cargo of a ship, maritime navigational facilities, etc.-
(1) Whoever unlawfully and intentionally-
(a) commits an act of violence against a person on board a fixed platform or a ship which is likely to endanger the safety of the fixed platform or, as the case may be, safe navigation of the ship shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to ten years and shall also be liable to fine;
(b) destroys a fixed platform or a ship or causes damage to a fixed platform or a ship or cargo of the ship in such manner which is likely to endanger the safety of such platform or safe navigation of such ship shall be punished with imprisonment for life;
(c) seizes or exercises control over a fixed platform or a ship by force or threatens or in any other form intimidates shall be punished with imprisonment for life;

Section 3 (1) (g) (i) (iv) and (v) of the SUA Act, 2002 reads as follows:
(g) in the course of commission of or in attempt to commit, any of the offences specified in … clauses (a) to (f) in connection with a ship-
(i) causes death to any person shall be punished with death;
(ii) ……;
(iii) ……;
(iv) seizes or threatens a person shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to ten years; and
(v) threatens to endanger a ship … shall be punished with imprisonment for a term which may extend to two years.
(emphasis supplied)
Relevant portions of Sec. 3 (7) and (8) ( c ) of the of the SUA Act, 2002 reads as follows:
Sec. 3 (7) : Subject to the provisions of sub- section (8), where an offence under sub- section (1) is committed outside India, the person committing such offence may be dealt with in respect thereof as if such offence had been committed at any place within India at which he may be found.
Sec. 3 (8) (c) : No court shall take cognizance of an offence punishable under this section which is committed outside India unless-
(a) …;
(b) …; or
(c) the alleged offender is a citizen of India or is on a fixed platform or on board a ship in relation to which such offence is committed when it enters the territorial waters of India or is found in India. (emphasis supplied)

Further a reading of Sec. 13 of the SUA Act 2002 which provides for presumption of offences under sec. 3 should alarm any lawyer appearing for an accused charged under SUA. It reads as follows:

Thus the burden shifts on to the accused making their criminal trial a very arduous one.

VKG.....SUA Act was specifically made to deal with terrorism in High Seas. Whether it is specified that it applies to terrorism exclusively or not is immaterial. For normal criminal activities every country has its own criminal laws and International bodies have common laws which most of the countries have ratified. It is to be applied when any terrorist activities take place. When the LeT team with Kasab and others came on a boat to Bombay it was a sea-borne terrorist act. But when the Italian Marines shoots at a boat under the mistaken belief that it was a pirate boat and kills two fishermen it is hardly an act of terrorism. If one applies SUA Act to this it will be an act like misuse of TADA or POTA to deal with ordinary crimes. So this SUA Act cannot be applied. 

Letter to Jon Bellish-Enrica Lexie

Mr.Jon Bellish, I have been following the Enrica Lexie case right from the beginning through news on internet. Only today while searching I got your post.
You have given that " The words “terror,” “terrorist,” or “terrorism” do not appear at all in the operative clauses of the SUA Convention, nor do they appear in any portion of India’s SUA Act. Thus Mr. Matthew’s argument that legal classification as a terrorist is a prerequisite to be charged under the SUA Act appears at odds with the text of the SUA Act itself and the Convention upon which it is based."
Sir, the SUA Act was made to deal with terrorism and piracy which has become very rampant for these last thirty or forty years. Hence is it necessary to specify that it is for dealing with terrorism. For other crimes there laws already existing.
Here when the Italian Marines shot at the boat St.Antony they had no intention of terrorism in their act. It is plain murder at sea. It was killing due to misunderstanding and it should be dealt with as such.
I was just thinking. A carpenters chisel is for cutting wood and shaping it into required objects. You can use for cutting vegetable also. But you don't use it for that purpose. Similarly SUA Act is for dealing with terrorism and hence it is used for dealing with terrorism and not for other criminal activities which are obviously not an act of terrorism.
Which country should try the marines should be decided as per international conventions for a murder at sea. Even though most of my fellow Indians feel that India has jurisdiction to try the case, I am of the opinion it is Italy which has the jurisdiction. The marines were on an Italian ship and from that ship the shots were fired. It is the act which is to be punished and not the result. So Italy should try the case. I am more convinced of my thinking is right because Mr.Haren Rawal, Additional Solicitor General appearing on behalf of the Government of India that India has no jurisdiction for which he was castigated and the charge of representing Centre was entrusted to another. Mr.Rawal could not have told this to the court unless has gone through the law and was convinced of the fact.
Guptan Veemboor

Radio Collar for the Italian Marines

I am wondering. Why Government of India or Government of Kerala  did not suggest to High Court to instruct the concerned persons to put Radio Collar on the two Italian Marines who are being released on bail with all precautions that they don't escape from India. Now they have been asked to stay within the jurisdiction of the Police Commissioner of Kochi and to get two Indians to stand surety for them and also the wonderful condition that the sureties should not put their foot outside Kerala. Radio Collars would have solved all these conditions. The P.C sitting in front of his PC could monitor every movement of these two ruthless killers who killed two innocent Indians probably just for target practice. We don't know whether racism was also involved. After all they are from Italy whose Mussolini was the fellow traveler of Hitler who was an acknowledged racist. We are all aware that Whites look down at all those with black or brown skins. Putting radio collar on people who may escape is not new. Only a couple of years back America put radio collar on the ankles of poor Indian students whose only crime was that they got into US on the ostentatious purposes of  studying in an American Campus of a University of the Gults. If America can do such a thing we can do definitely. We all know that while India that is Bharat is a rising Sun, America is a setting Sun and a pitch dark future awaits it. We are just behind America by a nose length and that too not a De'Gaullian nose at that. A Chou en Lai-ian nose. So we should put a radio collar on those white Italians who consider all Indians are not worth anything but two bullets.
Apart from the radio collar which should be more or less in the way of the collars worn by those with spondilitis ( so that it is very much visible and every patriotic Indians  can boo them) whether they should have to slate like board hanging in front and back with the letters "Italian @#$%. Boo Them" written on them. That way they and all Italians even those parading as Indians will know that we hold little respect to them. In fact we hate them. It is high time that the whole world recognize our position in the world and give due to respect to us. We will demand respect or take it by force. Our constitution will be amended that we can demand respect from anyone. We are waiting for the two third majority. As soon as the oil prices come down we will do it.

God's Safari

This question is as tough as the question Akbar asked Birbal--How many crows are there in Delhi? This is a tradition which has been followed for centuries. But is it necessary? Even if all the temples and other abodes of Gods are destroyed there will not be any PIL or rather GIL from the part of Gods. They will take it easy in their stride. In Kerala after the agrarian reforms the daily ration of food for so many Gods got reduced considerably. From so many 'paras' ( a volume measure used in Kerala for measuring paddy, rice etc and equivalent to some 10kg by weight) to just subsistence ration they did not protest. No calamities came except the EMS ministry was pulled down by vested interests where Gods were not a party. Only Gods  keepers were. So if this mode of transport to which Gods are accustomed to is withdrawn also there will not be any protests from their part. But the public may not take it lying down.

Bail to Italian Marines

And at last. High Court did the correct thing to grant them bail. The argument raised by the counsel for Kerala was childish or inane. When the passports of the marines are surrendered and the Italian Government was standing surety for their presence during trial was most idiotic objection. There is a news in Manorama on line that Kerala is going to oppose the bail application and that only it will ask the court to put stringent conditions while granting bail. Also the report says 'Government is "happy" to drop the SUA Act charges'. It is a mystery why the Government of Kerala should be so condescending to be happy to drop SUA Act charges? It simply indicates that SUA Act will not stand in a court and Government will look utterly foolish to prefer charges on that count. It will be like the pronouncement that this shooting was a terrorist action. It looks that Kerala Government is loosing steam slowly. Who knows in six months time the government will be happy to see that this case is settled somehow or other.

Enrica Lexie -Contentious issue of jurisdiction

High Court of Kerala has rejected the Italian Government's plea that Indian courts has no jurisdiction to try the case as the incident happened in waters beyond India territorial waters. High Court also observed that the killing of the fishermen were cruel and brutal and that the marines do not enjoy any sovereignty and they have acted on their own.
However impartial and just our courts may be, this issue of jurisdiction should be settled by an international body than a court of either of the country. In the case of Jayalalitha the case was shifted to Karnataka so that the trial and judgement will be independent. Similarly in case of the case of massacre of innocent Muslims the case was shifted to Maharashtra. Since here this case is between two nations viz. India and Italy this issue of jurisdiction should be settled by a third country acceptable to both the countries or by a UN recognized international body.
In this case of jurisdiction is the question of whether the killing of the fishermen was brutal or cruel is, in my layman's mind , of any relevance. Here it is only the question of jurisdiction.
As regards the sovereign immunity of the marines, they should have whatever rights they have on duty this time also they should have. They were put on the ship by the Government of Italy for the protection of the ship. Whatever acts they do is as the soldiers assigned to perform their duties. Whether they were on a naval ship or merchant ship is immaterial. The question who are they and whether they are on duty. If they were on a holiday the cannot have any immunity as then they are ordinary citizen.
I have not seen the whole judgment and written this only seeing the newspaper report.

Enrica Lexie-Jurisdiction

Section 3 of IPC reads : Sec. 3: Punishment for offences committed beyond but which by law may be tried within India:Any person liable by any Indian law to be tried for an offence committed beyond India shall be dealt with according to the provisions of this Code for any act committed beyond India in the same manner as if such act had been committed within India.What the sentence 'any person liable by any India law to be tried within India'. Does it not mean that this section is applicable to anyone bound by Indian laws? If such a person commits a crime beyond India's land boundary to be tried............... It is not applicable to anyone who is not bound by Indian laws. Italian marines are not bound by Indian laws. Italian Marines committed a crime in an Italian flagged ship which is as good as committing a crime in Italian soil. It is a wonder how this is interpreted as a crime to be tried in Indian courts.
I could not get any attributes in IPC that it applies to all. The law as given in IPC is applicable to only those who are bound by Indian laws. 
 When a foreign citizen is in India then it will apply to him also as the local law should apply to all.
In this case the Marines were not in Indian soil or something equivalent to Indian soil. So the Indian law cannot be applied to them. Or it seems to me.

Bail for Italian Marines

The argument that if released the marines will not be available is, to say the least, stupid. Italian government, that is a sovereign government is standing surety that they will be produced for trials. Italy is not a 'banana republic'. It is country of the European Union. As a mature nation India has to give credence when a nation take the responsibility for the marines. There were reports that the marines had told that they will surrender their passports. Just imagine, can two foreigners without any passport but with a fake passport  with no visa stamped can escape from India. Even when a common man goes to a foreign country the police man looks at the passport some ten times then your face once again the photo in passport and all. A relation of mine who was a US citizen was going back to US on the last day of the expiry of the Indian visa. He told me that the police man counted some ten times the number of days he has stayed in India to see whether he has over stayed. In such case how these two will be able to get out of India? And if say in a once in trillion or quadrillion case they escape can't be tried in absentia and punished ?. In these cases what is more important is punishing for the crime committed and not whether they stayed in jail or not. Objecting the bail is stupid and is just playing to the gallery.

Petrol Price Increase

Hai Mr.Malik. Here is one comment I wrote two days back. I shall follow it in next with one more as here 'time is out'.Guptan Veemboor (Bangalore) All are crying that increase in petrol price is burden to the 'common man' or it's Hindi equivalent 'aam aadmi'. The problem is with the definition of the term 'common man'. One Mr.Sachin has commented to my query 'who is a common man' the definition that 'the common man is one to whom one party says "our hand is with you" and then slap him with hand . That is common man.'. I liked that definition. It is quite witty. But that is a very broad definition. My definition is it is the people who travel in the 'cattle class'. It is not the cattle class Mr.Shashi Taroor has mentioned. It is those who travel by the dusty, dirty stuffy and overcrowded 2nd class unreserved compartments of our railways or those hanging precariously on the footboards of our city buses or hanging perilously with a finger to the window bars of a suburban train or those who have never traveled and lived all their life in the arid villages in utter poverty that they have a good meal once in a week or those who commit suicide due to debt or poverty. I cannot think that these people will be affected if the price of petrol goes sky high. In fact their indirect burden of paying tax (indirectly) to the government when they buy their meager provisions and other essentials. It is those 'little grains of sand and little drops of water' which subsidize the petrol filled in BMWs and Merces and all other four wheelers and two wheelers. This agitation is an agitation of the haves and not of the have-nots. The champions of the poor Left and their virulent opponent but avowedly pro poor Mamata also doing. Petrol price should be made such that it can live its own life without subsidies. I am a loner in this.
Hai Mr.Malik, Guptan Veemboor (Bangalore) In my opinion the real problem is lack of public transport in our cities. Had there been a very good public transport system middle class will not be depending on their own personal transport. And an increase in petrol price will not affect them as it is doing now. I have heard that in Singapore or London public transport is so good that one need not have a private vehicle at all. Lack of efficient public transport has made people to buy cars and two wheelers. Since these mode of transport occupy more road space per person roads become congested. When road become congested even if number of public transport vehicles increase due to traffic jams due to congestion on the roads, one cannot depend on the public transport. Then one feels that a car can take him or her faster to the destination and contribute to further congestion. It is a vicious circle and the problem compounds. Governments liberilisation has made this situation. Right from the beginning more stress should have been on mass transport system. Even pollution level would not have been this much. I would suggest that the remedy as of now will be restrict private vehicle movement in central areas ( or in American parlance down town area). In London central London is restricted for private vehicles I think. There was a news recently that our embassy in London has due of few million pound as fine for taking its vehicles in central London. That should be implemented in our cities and simultaneously increase public transport system. Only buses and taxis should ply in central area and for private vehicles put punitive toll. Like petrol diesel also should be de-controlled and trucks carrying food grain from FCI godowns to PDS godowns cash subsidy can be given depending on the distance they have run on government job. For all private running they also should pay market price. Needless to say diesel for cars and other personal vehicles they should pay market price.
Mr.Malik, I have sent two posts and this is the last word. Will the auto manufacturers allow the government to increase public transport system as their profit will nose dive. Who knows this agitation against petrol price increase has not tacit support from them? There were rumours that in Singur agitation there were rival business interest also involved. Already they slashed Rs50,000/-. Is it not an indication that they are getting panicky? With best regards, Guptan

Braggarts we are

Long back I have read a novel by Arthur Hailey titled 'In High Places'. There a stowaway was caught in a Candian Airline and a case is going on. The case get embroiled in the Candian politics and it is the hapless stowaway who suffers. Much worse than what he had undergone in sub-zero temperature outside the aircraft up high in air. I am not straight away comparing the two Italian Marines with the hapless stowaway. But there is good comparison between the two incidents. One imaginary and other real. The main stumbling block which deters the release of Marines on bail is the politics in Kerala. Unfortunately the shooting incident when the UDF the ruling coalition with Congress as the major partner and LDF the opposition which missed the bus by just four seats or so. And a by-election was due to take place. Any leniency towards the Italian Marines would have taken up by the opposition party and highlight that UDF was apathetic to the killed poor fishermen. And any thing connected with Italy is anathema for Left and Right. Mrs.Sonia Gandhi whose legs are the repository for all the blames for the performance of UPA-r is by birth Italian though by domicile Indian very much. So no leniency can be shown to Italians including normal decent behaviour. Also Indians suffer from a delusion that since British ruled India all British and all whites are our enemies. So we should  take each and every opportunity to harass them. When Ruling UDF gocernment sailed through Piravom by election with flying colours here comes another at Neyyattinkara. So UDF is in the same spot as before. No leniency. Hence when the bail application of the marines came the government lawyer said that if they are released they could tamper with evidences and impede the progress of the case. All the evidences are in police custody. The Italian Marines know hardly any English even and their Malayalam is limited to two words. Kothu for mosquitoes and eli for rat. The two constant companions in their incarceration. In what way they can impede the progress of the case or how they can tamper the evidence is not the relevant thing. The bail was rejected. In all probability the court must have played it safe. In such high profile case where the Prime Minister of another nation is talking to Indian PM and all it is better to pass the buck to higher ups to take appropriate decision. And so like the stowaway the Italian Marines are continuing their residence as guests of Kerala Government in the company of 'Kothus' and 'Elis' for constant companions. We are behaving like braggart. We can hardly do anything to our men in the hands of pirates or foreign governments but show all courage to the two marines who were tricked to come to Cochin and get caught. If the ship Enrica Lexie had sailed off without committing this blunder of coming to Cochin they would have been back in business as usual. Now all are gleefully running around the marines who have been caught.

Enrica Lexie post to Capt. Tom

Hello Captain, This is just my random thoughts. I am wondering if it had been so that the poor fishermen who were killed were really some Somalian pirates would there have been so much out cry? Will there be any question why the protocol to avoid piracy was not followed? Whether warning shots were fired or water hoses used? In my opinion there would have been no such questions. Probably the two Italian Marines would have been congratulated for two of the outlaws. But unfortunately the calculation  of the Marines went wrong. Even when two pirates are killed it is loss of two lives. Same as that of two fishermen. Do anyone think what made them pirates. As a navy man you will hate. I know. But it is the worst economic condition that has driven these desperadoes to piracy. Let me repeat you will not be able to stomach this view because you are directly affected. Here I sitting in Bangalore can express the opinion as it will not in no way affect me. I hope you get me. So the actual crime the marines have done they made a very serious mistake in thinking the fishermen were pirates. There also let me give some opinion of mine. The general attitude of people of the category of these fishermen the headload workers and such are arrogance. They hate anyone with some money. To them a big ship represents money and their psyche is that to hurt and annoy. Here the owner of the boat when he got a nice compensation ( and most probably with some liquor he must have consumed to celebrate the occasion )has told that the boat was being driven by one of the killed fishermen and he did not have any license to drive it. He also told that the boat was being driven very fast towards the ship. In all probability the driver must have been drunk and thought that he can cross the path of the ship before it reached the point. Such a behaviour can naturally evoke suspicion in the minds of the guards I feel.That must have prompted them to fire. And another thing about the location. The incident occurred at about 4 pm. After that the boat reached Neendakara at about 10 pm. It took 6 hours for the boat to reach the shore. Naturally with two dead bodies in the boat it should have gone at top speed. At say 8 knots speed in 6 hrs it must have traveled some 50 nautical miles.  Even if the spot was not straight perpendicular to Neendakara it should have been some 40 nautical miles from the shore which is out of contiguous zone and in EEZ. And the question is whether EEZ is international zone or the country's zone. These things should be cleared before proceeding with the case. I feel before clearing these issues going ahead with the trial is not proper. This is just my opinion. You may be holding your own. After all everyone will have their opinions on anything. We have a saying in Malayalam. Even if someone beats his own mother there will two opinions. Like that.